The Unlikely Pilgrimage of Harold Fry, by Rachel Joyce

Discussed Thursday, 22^nd August 2013, Forester & Flower, Combe Down

Six out of the nine of us were there: Chris B, Chris W, Mark T, Ras, Rob (who had not finished the book) and Richard; (apols from Mark Th, Neil [who sent his views by e-mail, below], and Steve [who sent a short review with more to come later – also below]).

As often, there were a range of views – some thought that it was a good and enjoyable book, others were irritated by the lack of realism.

Selected by Richard as his wife had recommended it, his summary suggested that as Rachel Joyce is a writer of successful radio plays, there was quite good dialogue and story development. Initially, he rather disliked it, feeling that it was unrealistic, light, and a little meaningless; but by the end, he felt that it was interesting, quite well written, and written from a ‘magical realism’ perspective which means that one needed to suspend judgement (shoes which don’t wear out, foraging off the land with no experience, etc etc).

From reading other reviews, Richard realised that the book was an updated version of an old form of writing, the allegory. Once it had been mentioned in a review, the links with “Pilgrim’s Progress: the journey of Christian through Vanity Fair and the Slough of Despond to the Celestial City” seemed quite clear: a humble, everyman hero struggling on his way, with his burden on his back. Obviously some of the religious symbolism in Pilgrim’s Progress isn’t here in this modern-day version, but Harold is an Everyman figure whose spiritual journey is prone to pitfalls and distraction and presented as both heroic and mundane. Some of the symbolism related to the fact that ostensibly Harold Fry is setting out on his long walk from Devon to Berwick-on-Tweed to save his friend, Queenie Hennessy, who is dying of cancer in a nursing home; but this was also a symbolic journey, with Harold trying to save himself from the "slough of despond" into which his own life has sunk. One person suggested that the whole book could almost have been Harold’s fantasy. 

Although a wide range of views was expressed, most fell into one of two categories: those who liked and enjoyed it, and those who found it unrealistic, shallow and frustrating.

Positives included:

·      the easy style,

·      good dialogue,

·      Harold and Maureen - good and quite well drawn characters (although ‘magical realism’ here again – not really believable, and many realised from the first introduction that David had died)’

·      a book celebrating the kindness of strangers,

·      Harold's non-judgmental responses to everyone he meets forms the crux of the narrative,
·      A novel inspired by loss, it contains a really good summation of grief – not expressed by Harold, but by his neighbour Rex (also a figure from Bunyan: named Plausible), who is gradually coming to terms with the death of his wife: "I miss her all the time. I know in my head that she has gone. The only difference is that I am getting used to the pain. It's like discovering a great hole in the ground. To begin with, you forget it's there and keep falling in. After a while, it's still there, but you learn to walk round it.”

Negatives:

·      prone to sentimentality,

·      the overpoweringly good intentions of its hero can seem a little pious

·      unrealistic

Overall:

·      Richard felt that it was a good read and enjoyed lots about it.

·      Mark T liked it, feeling that the it was rather Murakami-like and allowed one to suspend realism.

·      Chris B “loved it”, enjoyed the fact that it started in Kingsbridge (a place he knows well (and one slight irritation is that there is NO petrol station where the book describes one!), liked the fact that Harold was an ordinary man – and throughout the book, felt that this was a consistent picture being painted, felt the relationship between the spouses was a very true reflection, liked how both characters developed, liked the anti-climax at the end; and loved the idea of just putting one foot in front of the other. “I thoroughly enjoyed the book.”

·      Ras was frustrated by Harold and his refusal to (for example) wear boots when walking. He found he had not a lot of sympathy for Harold, although it was good to see that he did complete the walk and get there. On the other hand, he felt that Maureen came over quite well; the hangers-on were different and realistic and well done – overall, a reasonably enjoyable read but frustrated by Harold.

·      Chris W felt that it was shallow and missed the opportunity to create more believable characters. In some ways, similar to the 100-year-old-man, irritating, very light-hearted but without the humour of that book. The hangers-on wanting to link in with his celebrity was more believable.

·      Steve said (by e-mail) that: “I'll send a review shortly but in brief, I thought this was a very consumable but rather lightweight book. Designed to appeal to the concerns of middle England (dead marriages, talking to strangers, being blind to the reality of family relationships, the meaning of life…) it was filled with recognisable characters, in settings anyone up and down the country could identify with. However, for me it also had a constant air of implausibility. How likely would My Fry really be to keep walking without thinking the better of it - especially given the kind of man the author had so carefully described? Mrs Fry was a pantomime villainess for the first part and her reformation as the book went on  also stretched credibility. In the end, I couldn't give a toss whether he got there or not. Disappointed, because I'd wanted to read it for a while.”

·      Neil said (by email) that “I have to admit to being a little confused by my feelings towards this book. On the one hand the simplistic storytelling riddled with such unlikely scenarios felt even more ridiculous than those described in that rather similar book, 100 year old man who.. The idea that Harold would just set off on this walk and keep going, that he would walk for weeks in the same pair of completely inappropriate shoes and the same clothes, managing to live off the land at times, etc. etc. was hard to swallow as was the highly contrived bunch of misfits that joined him and then equally suddenly disappeared with no interest in his journey's end.  But while all this was driving me nuts, the underlying emotional story of his relationship with his wife and the tragic backstory of their son did hold my attention and I found myself emotionally quite involved by the end.  However, I am inclined to put that down to my state of mind at the time rather than the book and looking back, while this was an easy read, I am left with a feeling of it having been rather unsatisfying.  The redeeming feature of 100 year old man for me was the dry humour that ran throughout, while this book seemed to wallow in mawkish reflection on scenarios that seem to have been lifted entirely from 1970's TV plays. When I finished the book I might have been inclined to give it a 6.5, but with the benefit of hindsight this has slipped to a 5.”

The hundred-year man who jumped out of the window and disappeared - by Jonas Jonassen

The hundred-year man who jumped out of the window and disappeared - by Jonas Jonassen

Discussed April 2013


As usual there was quite a variety of opinion on this book bringing out both lighthearted amusement and enjoyment with some and irritation and  tedium with others.

So, what were the good bits?

* Interesting how the book interwove a variety of scenes in 20th century history
* Simplistic light-hearted Swedish humour
* Innocence and quirkiness of the story
* Marginal implausibility of the storyline throughout(just a bit)
* The concept of an OAP breaking loose from the shackles of his Home and finding freedom.
* The use of vodka throughout to lubricate the storyline.
* A reminder of the good old days growing up making pipe bombs !?
* The escapism of climbing through a window to live a hedonistic lifestyle
* The subtle interlinking of Presidents and world leaders into the story
* Lightly written and better than Dickens -Mildly amusing and occasionally enjoyable.

and the less good bits.....

* The Swedish humour does not translate well - too much slapstick and lack of sophistication
* Silly, farcical and repetitive
* Were all the historical flashbacks really correct? Misleading information about nuclear weapons.
* Tiresome and the rot really set in when the elephant turned up!
* Could have been a shorter novella.
* Leading character was too a-political.
* Story lacked any female involvement
* Rather like the Tom Sharpe Wilt farces - basic unsophisticated humour level.

- So really a book you've got to read to find out whether it amuses or irritates you.

Interestingly after the initial debate there was then discussion about whether in fact there were  more profound and hidden meanings in the book than had been discovered. Was it just  a lighthearted and ' frothy' read or was there was much more depth in the story that might have been missed by the erudite panel? Well nobody was quite sure but it was clear that with a lot of vodka the story moved along with a fair pace which kept everybody mildly amused some of the time.
.... Perhaps the final message ( as retirement beckons - for some anyway ) was that there may be hope for all of us .......so long as we can still get our leg over the window cill. ( no jokes)

Chris W.

Richard V: I have finally read this, having now managed to catch up on the books I could not get in India.  I really enjoyed this book, for lots of reasons.  I enjoyed the easy style and found the humour generally acceptable (unusually for me) and I very much enjoyed the overall quirkiness of it.  I really liked the speedy examination of most  of the important historical events over the 20th century, and the book reminded me a lot of the Woody Allen film, Zelig, where WA appears as part of all of these historic situations - and that was what our protagonist did here, too.

So, a clever book, rather erudite in its understanding of history (although, having read Chris's notes above, I agree that he may not have represented the creation of the Atomic Bomb with complete accuracy!), and with a very light touch.  I might recommend it to someone who dislikes history but would quite like to know what did happen in the world over the last 100 years! 

I see the notes above have no scores, but my score is: 7.5

The Inheritors - William Golding

The Pulteney Arms, Bath, March 28^th 2013. Present: SC, CW, RA, RG, CB, RV

A respectable six gathered to discuss Golding's rapidly-written second novel. Selected by Steve because he'd become very familiar with the spine in his youth, when it occupied one of the shelves in the upstairs toilet, and had subsequently retained an uneasy feeling of unfinished business…

Fair to say the club shot off in all directions over this. Two contrasting but eminently enjoyable reviews are quoted later in their entirety – because they're worth it – but before those, here are some selected thoughts.

A number of us had difficulty in relating to events and locations as they were described. Despite the extensive foreword that explained how Golding went to great lengths to ensure he'd got the topography right (by asking a fellow teacher), there was a common struggle to visualise the details of the action. To some extent this was because Golding wanted us to understand that the surroundings meant everything to the protagonists. So events were so bound up in the setting that it was of critical importance to be able to see it – to have a picture. Some of us felt Golding fell a bit short in carrying that off.

The book was undoubtedly thought-provoking. One of our longer discussions ensued, covering Neanderthal/Homo Sapiens overlap, black/white skin (wouldn't the first Homo Sapiens have been black?). Intelligent use of different styles to point up the gulf between the two: the compelling innocence of Lok against the sinister plotting and wider knowledge (and two-syllable name – Bath Rugby eat your hearts out) of Tuami.

RV made the point that the book contained strong references to and inferences of lost skills, along with the lost innocence of the Neanderthals. These included telepathy or certainly to knowing (and trusting) something without understanding what it was.

Scores ranged between a sandpapered 3 and a sangria-fuelled 9.8. This month's contest to win a slightly-foxed edition of 'Fanny's Fancies' (1963) is to identify the reviewer responsible for each of those scores. Neil wrote:

'I have a picture.

There is a large pile of stones like a cave and inside people are talking and drinking off-honey from clear jars, but I am not there. I am in a hot place, much sand, I am not by the sea, but it is nearby. I have a square black stone and it has many words. When I touch it more words come, and more and more. Words, like twig and log and stag, but they do not mean twig or log or stag and it hurts my head. Outer Neil wants to be clever and make the people clap, but inner Neil is sad and heavy because of all the words he cannot make sense of. The New People like these words and say it is clever, but I am one of the people from the overhang who does not share this picture and thinks the words are like when the people go to the river and instead of making water they make the other thing...these words are the other thing. Maybe if I touch the stone again tomorrow some new words will be there about old Mal climbing out of a hole in the stone cave and could not be found and these words will be simple and make Neil laugh and talk.'

(Neil was stuck in Dubai for work while reading the book).

And this is Mark Th's view:

'Neil’s excellent spoof of the Inheritors came close to the anxieties I had before re-reading it. I had read and really enjoyed this book in my early twenties and was worried that second time around – like Crime and Punishment – it would seem only half the book I remembered from my relative youth. In particular I wondered if Golding’s conceit of making the Neanderthals gentle and loving and showing humans as inherently violent would feel effective on second reading, and also the Neanderthal mindset might seem unconvincing or silly. In this case though, the book was just as rewarding second time around. It still seems extraordinary that a writer would take the risk of writing a novel (mainly) from the point of view of a Neanderthal and manage to tell a story that grips as much as this did. Even more bravely he chose the least intelligent of the group who is innocently unable to comprehend what he is seeing at all and so cannot ‘get’ the new people that have moved in. I can sympathise with the view that this means the reader cannot know exactly what is happening and has to infer what might be going on and that this can be frustrating. But I did not mind this at all and felt that the last chapter resolved, at least in a general sense, what had been going on as the humans panicked, fell back on ritualistic behaviour and demonised the Neanderthals. The penultimate chapter where he pans back and describes Lok's ending was so powerfully moving that it comes to mind well after the end of the book. I loved the way he created a sense of the Neanderthal outlook - locked in the present, tied to the senses and with (like a young human child) little working memory and limited ability to think logically. The picture of humans as seeking to survive but also seeking power, being fearful of outsiders and capable of justifying extreme violence towards those we have caricatured as evil (Saddam, Jews, Tutsis, Bosnian muslims etc) was deeply shocking when presented in this simple and stark way (though my reservation is that the book is perhaps too pessimistic in its take).'

(Mark was on holiday).

More words than usual but I honestly can't think of anything to add to those two reviews – thanks for contributing them!

Half Blood Blues - Esi Edugyan

The Crown, Bathford, 28th February 2013

A select group, with absentees due to overseas engagements, thespian diversions and ill health.

It was a qualified thumbs up for Half Blood Blues. Chris B (whose choice it was and who sent his notes ahead) spoke for most of us when he highlighted the book's general accessibility – despite the extensive use of vernacular, it 'winged along' nicely. We bought into the atmosphere, the way the tension of the immediate pre-war period and then of the fall of Paris was used not just as a background but as a framework for the story. The part of the story involving Sid and Chip as older men also created a believable and affectionate portrait of two old sparring partners, who had been through a lot together and who still (at least on Sid's part) hadn't really worked it all out.

Lots to enjoy: The detective story structure kept us guessing until the end, and then didn't necessarily fill in all the blanks, depending on your point of view. There was a great love story going on between Sid and Delilah, which most felt was sensitively and powerfully expressed – we really felt his frustration and empathized with his lack of faith in his ability to compete with a younger man, and cheered for him when he got his girl (for a while, at least). Sid was a very human and fallible narrator/protagonist.

Edugyan's writing style was compact yet powerful; there were some passages that demanded to be read again simply because you suddenly realized that she'd painted a tremendously powerful picture without making you aware of any kind of elaborate setup – guerrilla writing? For example Hiero's playing was effectively described as 'solar'… This unpretentious voice helped the narrative to flow, and in particular her gift for striking a believable note in dialogue between 'blokey blokes' was noted and appreciated. The simple idea of US and German jazz musicians, black and white, getting together just for the love of the music, made for a beguiling central thread.

It wasn't a smooth ride all the way however: There was some trenchant criticism that the book managed, despite its central theme, to avoid any mention of the Nazi sterilization programme that – some sources say – rendered all German-born blacks incapable of procreation by 1937. And there was quite a lot of discussion about the credibility of the plot. Did we really believe or relate to the motivation that drove Sid to pull the visa trick? Would Sid's obvious (but usually resigned rather than bitter and twisted) jealousy have come out that way? For several that final chapter didn't quite live up to the ground carefully laid before it.

In summary:

Chris B: Found it easy to read though didn't make a deep impact afterwards. Drew a parallel with Dancing on the Edge - recent BBC drama. No score given yet
Steve: liked it for its voice, style and ability to surprise (human zoo?). 7.5 points

Ras: Quite enjoyed it, though prose a bit indigestible, and completely thwarted by the end. 5 points

Chris W: Found it very easy to read – could empathise with Sid and his loves, jealousy. Powerful about Paris – wanted more from Hiero at the end. 7 points

Neil: Found it hard to get started but then enjoyed it, particularly the interplay between Sid and Chip. However, found the visa twist hard to stomach. Plausibility issues. 6.8 points

Mark Th: Superb awareness of and ability to write male relationships; language a bit inconsistent; some historical issues. Overall enjoyable: 7.3 points

Rob - one of the missing people, basically agrees almost totally with the above summary, including that the last chapter sold the reader a bit short. 7.5 

This Thing of Darkness by Harry Thompson

-->

This Thing of Darkness – Harry Thompson

Venue: The Crown, Bathford

Date: Thursday 31st Jan 13.  We had a full turn out except for Richard, in India.

Ras's comments:

This was an easy and most enjoyable read that captured vividly the atmosphere of the early 19th century.  The story addressed some of the key issues about who we are, how we came about and our purpose on earth.  It also touches on the dilemma for the evolutionists about morality and social duties if it is just the survival of the fittest.  This developed in the minds of the supporters of eugenics/euthanasia – a terrifying prospect for the old or infirm and an everyday risk for the old natives in Tierra del Fuego.  The time jumps were not a problem as it was necessary to navigate through to the significant parts of the tale; these were numerous and colourful as well as following closely to the historical record.  There was much humour intermingled with the tragedy and cruelty.  A case in point is the comment after Darwin’s outburst when he denies the existence of God with the confusion of the less than effective butler who did not know whether to offer more cabbage or not.

Fitzroy was the most sympathetically treated and was clearly an outstanding leader, honest, straight, quick-witted, fair and farsighted.  His views on the rights of natives/indigenous people were 100 years ahead of his time and well ahead of the religious zealots and missionaries who stumbled their way across the world with bumbling ignorance and good, but wrong, intentions.  His hard line religious beliefs were not uncommon for the mid 19th century even if they seem strange today.  His treatment by Government, corporations, the establishment and the Royal Navy was appalling even by today’s standards.  This brings me to my key impression from the book; it was all so relevant today:

•          Decisions were taken for political reasons with spin and vested interest of greater import than the evidence available.  In this story it was nearly always to the detriment of Fitzroy.  It was sad that such a hard-working, honest and generous public servant should be treated so badly.  Jemmy Button's sad tale supports this theme. Even the French lauded Captain Maury USN above Fitzroy in the presentation to him of a cheap clock (compare this to Fitzroy furnishing the Beagle with extra very expensive chronometers to improve the accuracy of his surveying). It is surprising that he did not commit suicide sooner!  Maury’s contribution to oceanography was significant, but I believe it was Fitzroy who understood that weather could be forecast by using observations; a unique insight at the time.

•          The environment was one of austerity and limited Government resources.

•          There was a running dispute over the sovereignty of the Falkland Islands with the then despotic Argentinian leader.

•          There was a fierce debate between enlightened scientists and the church over the evolution/transmutation argument, which abounds today even when the DNA and fossil evidence is so overwhelming.

Darwin on the other hand comes off far less well than Fitzroy in this account.  Clearly he had difficulty publishing his theory in the Origin of Species owing to the strength of his wife’s belief.  For a young man he was particularly staid always responding in accordance with convention rather than using his initiative; perhaps because, originally, he was destined for the church.  He only published because Alfred Russel Wallace had developed the same theory and he wanted his life’s work recognised.

•          Chris W started the round of comments and had to admit that he had only read about 200 pages.  In spite of his interest in history, he would have preferred to have read a history book on the subject as the narrative was brittle, the characters did not come alive; not a pager turn.  (Clearly not enough pages turned.) 

•          Neil was next.  He was daunted by the length of the book, but got stuck in and was hooked after about 100 pages with the landfall in a terrifying storm; a remarkable story and really good read. 

•          Mark Th did not enjoy it as much as he thought he would, but thought it a fascinating idea for a story.  However, it was entertaining with some good humour.  The prose though was too dry and needed more detail of life on board.  The result was that it was too simply told to build up adequately for the ultimate tragedy. (Not finished and at about page 580) 

•          Mark T found it hard going and turgid.  However, having met a young lady at a party recently and the conversation turning to books she has inspired him to weigh anchor and get reading as she was full of praise for the book. (At about page 110) 

•          Steve, felt it was the sort of book he should enjoy.  He finds this period of history fascinating.  A Man Booker prize nomination, it probably missed the shortlist because it was too long.  Of concern was the issue of whether it was a novel or a biography, which bits could we learn some history and which parts were fictional padding; for example the tale about Commodore Mason and the rescue of the Challenger’s crew.  That said he found it a thoroughly enjoyable and fascinating read. 

•          Rob’s problem was that he could not make out if it was a history book, fiction or a biography as it appeared to be none of the above.  He gave up after 100 pages.  The style was Biggles-esk and he lost the will to live; it was no competition for the other books on his bedside table. 

•          Finally, Chris B said that he loved it, even if it was a bit long.  He was intrigued by the differences between the two main characters and how their relationship developed through the story, particularly being thrown together in such cramped conditions for so long.  There were fascinating glimpses in the book of how the world was changing with industrialisation, railways, steamships and philosophical thinking etc.

Well, in conclusion it appears to have been a bit of a Marmite book; well maybe not as those who gave up after only a few pages were probably not qualified to comment.  It was disappointing that only four of the eight present had finished it, but those who had were particularly well rewarded with a good read.  Taking up on Mark T’s admonishment by his young school mistress there will be extra homework for those who fell short of the task.  Alternatively, the Coxswain will be asked to let the cat out of the bag and have the grating rigged for six of the best.

(Some did not have access to the maps at the front of the book and this impacted on their enjoyment of the book and understanding of the magnitude of the surveying task involved.  As a Midshipman I spent a short acquaint period in a Survey Ship, even then in the early 70’s it was a significant manpower intensive task recording each position relative to one another and then transcribing them to a master chart.  Inshore soundings were carried out from small launches by hand, with only the deeper/wider areas covered by the mother ship with an echo sounder.  The area of Tierra del Fuego being charted was over 400 miles long, covering and area similar to that of England and Wales.  There was no GPS in the 1800’s, all positions had to be verified by celestial sights (sun and star sights) and sextant angles between geographical features taken for subsequent reconstruction of their position and height/depth on a master chart.  The weather in the area is pretty wet and windy most of the time making the recording of all the data even more taxing.  Add to that the limited quality of their clothing, what they achieved was quite remarkable and their data still forms the backbone of the charts being produced for that area, even today.)

Richard sent the following comments from India:  “I thought that it was tremendously well written; I found it a gripping story and it was very much a 'page-turner' (except for a very short section about 500 pages into the book, where it focussed more on Darwin and his travels - I think he wrote much more sensitively and interestingly about FitzRoy than about Darwin); the characterisation was excellent - I really got to know the main characters in great depth, and yet I also felt that I knew quite well the huge host of other and more minor ones that populated this fascinating account; the science was gripping (and of course these debates are still being played out now both in the UK and across various parts of the world); the tragedy of many aspects of colonialism; how ill-treated poor FitzRoy was in so many ways; how amazing a man he was and how he was so far-sighted and creative.”

Chris B's own notes on finishing the book:Another book with mixed reactions from the Blokes. For me, a most enjoyable read, despite its length. It engages through its characters, especially Captain Fitzroy and Darwin, the excitement of many of the adventures and challenges faced on the voyages and the philosophical exploration of the challenges to the scriptural orthodoxy of the creation and flood. It is well researched, despite occasional lapses e.g. in some nautical descriptions. It makes the conservative god-fearing captain a sympathetic character wrestling with his demons, his principles of respect for the native people he meets on the way and his mental illness as well as the bureaucracy and politicking of his bosses, the venal buccaneers and misguided missionaries and the raging elements. Darwin is given the growing and inexorable logic of his position on the slow evolution of the earth's geology and fauna and flora, but an increasingly unattractive selfishness and careerist focus. 

The times of change towards an industrial and increasingly polluted and money focused age are provided as a convincing context for the adventures, discoveries and human tensions in the story. The sheer toughness of life whether on board ship or in coping with frequent child, partner and friend deaths from illness, accident and aggression is not avoided but again does not overshadow the human story or the sheer power of Darwin's emerging discoveries.

It is a book to make you think about the meaning of life itself and certainly challenges any notions of either a benign or a literal God of the Old Testament. 
The kitty stood at £21.35p - not sure who made off with it at the end of the night...

All Quiet on the Western Front - Erich Maria Remarque

The Devonshire Arms, Wellsway, Dec 28th 2012.

Mark Th enjoyed the book and felt it was as vivid as the Radio 4 programme ‘From Our Own Correspondent’ in detailing in very human terms what it is like for combatants to experience traumatic times – in this case, a war.  The alternation of scenes which foregrounded the stress of combat with the more relaxed scenes which illustrated the simple pleasures that had to be snatched in recreation between fighting (eating, smoking, resting) built through the book to create a picture of almost unbearable stress at the front.  He had chosen it with very little forethought but was pleased to have read it.

Steve was more positive still, and was surprised by this as he had read the book years ago and it had made little impression on him at the time.  This time round, however, the found the book a ‘stunning’ read – a simple ordinary soldier’s perspective that is, for Steve, the yardstick against which all other war books should be measured.

Rob, on the other hand, was less effusive and where Mark Th had seen a powerful accretion of vignettes, Rob felt that the episodic structure was fragmented so that overall the book was not particularly engrossing.  He was most drawn by the powerful points the book made about the politics of war and the sense of solidarity felt by the German protagonists with soldiers on the ‘other’ side.

Chris B also saw a journalistic quality in the writing: for him it read like detailed reportage.  His research had shown, however, that the author had comparatively little experience of active service at the front and there was some speculation on his motives for writing the book.  Chris also noted the use of a second narrator at the end of the book.  This had the effect of freeing the author, so allowing Paul to escape a return to civilian life.

Ras also enjoyed the book’s basic realism and saw the separation of soldiers and politicians as a key theme.  The book was very effective in bringing home the sense that this was the first large-scale industrial war, and at the same time a war that people at home just did not understand. Here he saw some parallels here with Blair and Iraq and the comparative lack of understanding on the part of politicians and public.

Neil too, was very impressed by the book and pointed up some scenes that were most convincing, such as the brutality of corporal Himmelstoss during the training of the new recruits, and the hospital scene in the church.  These and other scenes combined to create a powerful sense of waiting day in and day out to see the next action.

Mark T also saw the book as very powerful and was moved by the plight of the young recruit at the end, who shits his pants in his first taste of battle and soon after this, dies.  Mark also noted the battle scene in the cemetery when exposed corpses and fallen colleagues could not be distinguished. And some of us we weren’t surprised that Mark particularly enjoyed the account of the night spent with the three French girls they met by the canal.

Richard commented by email that he found it to be gripping, excellently written, and it did not feel at all dated. He especially liked: Remarque's descriptions of the depth of relationships between comrades in arms; the reasons for their gallows humour - similar to the reasons that surgeons and other hospital staff sometimes 'joke' about their patients); the sense of awfulness and distance between them and ‘real people’ at home (one of the major themes of the novel is the difficulty of soldiers to revert to civilian life after having experienced extreme combat situations); the way that although all the boys are young, their youth has left them; the section with Paul guarding prisoners of war and his comments on what makes enemies enemies (politicians deciding one way, and then maybe deciding the other way tomorrow).

He also found the  comments about the loss of youth and the responsibilities of the older generations very telling. Although the actual nature of the war is different, Richard, like others at the meeting, saw to be big overlaps between this and (say) Iraq.

There was later further discussion of the lack of hatred felt by the soldiers in the book and the popular drive to war when the full impact is not realised by the civilian population.